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  1. #1
    feelin' Freddie Mercury
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    How Evangelicals Lost Their Way

    Terrific article by Michael Gerson, himself an Evangelical, and a former member of the George W. Bush administration.

    It's long, but it goes into the history of the evangelical movement, and explains why and how it became 'captured' and used by politicians, most especially our current POTUS.

    https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine...tation/554066/


    excerpt:

    One of the most extraordinary things about our current politics—really, one of the most extraordinary developments of recent political history—is the loyal adherence of religious conservatives to Donald Trump. The president won four-fifths of the votes of white evangelical Christians. This was a higher level of support than either Ronald Reagan or George W. Bush, an outspoken evangelical himself, ever received. Trump’s background and beliefs could hardly be more incompatible with traditional Christian models of life and leadership. Trump’s past political stances (he once supported the right to partial-birth abortion), his character (he has bragged about sexually assaulting women), and even his language (he introduced the words ***** and shithole into presidential discourse) would more naturally lead religious conservatives toward exorcism than alliance. This is a man who has cruelly publicized his infidelities, made disturbing sexual comments about his elder daughter, and boasted about the size of his penis on the debate stage. His lawyer reportedly arranged a $130,000 payment to a porn star to dissuade her from disclosing an alleged affair.

    Yet religious conservatives who once blanched at PG-13 public standards now yawn at such NC-17 maneuvers. We are a long way from The Book of Virtues. Trump supporters tend to dismiss moral scruples about his behavior as squeamishness over the president’s “style.” But the problem is the distinctly non-Christian substance of his values. Trump’s unapologetic materialism—his equation of financial and social success with human achievement and worth—is a negation of Christian teaching. His tribalism and hatred for “the other” stand in direct opposition to Jesus’s radical ethic of neighbor love. Trump’s strength-worship and contempt for “losers” smack more of Nietzsche than of Christ. Blessed are the proud. Blessed are the ruthless. Blessed are the shameless. Blessed are those who hunger and thirst after fame...
    Monkhouse: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    System: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President, for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind


  2. #2
    Opus was just napping
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    My thinking is that they never had a way. They just never had to so baldly back someone that offered zero cover for their morally bankrupt ways before.
    In the time of battle you don't rise to the occasion you resort to the level of your conditioning...

  3. #3
    What the what???
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    Just an opinion, but my sense is that they grew weary of candidates campaigning on the right in the primaries, then running to the middle in the general. Trump* offered the promise of something different, and when he chose Pence that sealed the deal. They put their money on him and now they’re stuck with him.

    What I have a harder time understanding is why Evangelicals aren’t now leading the charge for impeachment. His behavior certainly justifies them turning on him and Pence would give them the closest thing to a Christian theocracy they are likely to ever get.


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  4. #4
    RoadBikeReview Member
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    Islamophobia and Christian nationalism play an important role in Don Juan Trump's support ... and it was no accident Mike Pence was selected as VP.

    Good topic and post SS --- after all, America is God's Plan!
    I am 100% convinced the internet and social media are not the salvation to human civility.

  5. #5
    Master debator.
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    I posted this scathing article a while back, it hits the same mark:

    And yet today, you openly give a “mulligan” to a white Republican man so riddled with depravity, so littered with extramarital affairs, so unapologetically vile, with such a vast resume of moral filth—that the mind boggles.

    https://johnpavlovitz.com/2018/01/24...hn%20Pavlovitz
    "I felt bad because I couldn't wheelie; until I met a man with no bicycle"

  6. #6
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    Let's call a spade a spade here. Evangelicals support Trump because Trump promises to bring back "whiteness" to America. Or are they supporting Trump for his Christian values?

  7. #7
    gus68
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    I struggle to understand how the party who claim to be constitutional purists are in the same party where a large segment want a church state. In some cases they are even the same people. Well,I guess constitutional purists when they bend the 2nd amendment their way....

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    Evangelicals support Trump because Trump promises to bring back "whiteness" to America.
    If all else fails just scream That's Racist!

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    Let's call a spade a spade here. Evangelicals support Trump because Trump promises to bring back "whiteness" to America. Or are they supporting Trump for his Christian values?
    White Power & The Cross:

    https://thinkprogress.org/christian-...-b8f9cdc16239/

    Need more --- Roy Moore
    I am 100% convinced the internet and social media are not the salvation to human civility.

  10. #10
    Russian Troll Farmer
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    When they say "evangelicals", they mostly mean SOUTHERN WHITE evangelicals. It's hardly surprising, as they are probably more easily duped, and anybody who's ever spent any time in Dixie knows, what you say publicly is more important than what you actually DO.
    "L'enfer, c'est les autres"

  11. #11
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    religion is the worst thing humans ever invented...
    Ancient Astronaut theorists say, 'YES!'

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local Hero View Post
    If all else fails just scream That's Racist!
    Where did I use the term racist? Why do you ascribe such usage to me when I have not used it? I know you like to troll, but at least try to make it look like you're debating? How about read the article by Troutmd to understand what I was referring to: White Christian America. You might learn something.

  13. #13
    I make Eagles fly
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    religion is the worst thing humans ever invented...
    Can’t figure out people’s necessity for a magical sky fairy
    If you don't follow the liberal flock, you are called a troll.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Local Hero View Post
    If all else fails just scream That's Racist!
    So, Trump has done absolutely nothing to promote that particular perception of himself? Really??

    C'mon, bro. I'm high right now, but not that high. No one is.
    .
    Monkhouse: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    System: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President, for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind


  15. #15
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    Soooo... Did anyone actually read the article?

    It's actually quite good.

    .
    Monkhouse: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    System: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President, for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind


  16. #16
    feh
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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemShock View Post
    Soooo... Did anyone actually read the article?

    It's actually quite good.

    .
    Yes, I read it.

    The people that should read it won't, though. And if they were somehow forced to, cognitive dissonance would prevent any introspection.
    What's the Matter with Kansas?

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by SystemShock View Post
    Soooo... Did anyone actually read the article?

    It's actually quite good.

    .
    yes I read it. And I have similar sentiments. I'm just not anywhere close to putting such sentiments into words and convey to the public like the author has.

  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by feh View Post
    Yes, I read it.

    The people that should read it won't, though. And if they were somehow forced to, cognitive dissonance would prevent any introspection.
    Tell me about it. I have a very religious close relative who's an ardent Trump supporter, in spite of him being pretty obviously about the least Christian guy imaginable.

    The knots she ties herself into trying to reconcile her faith with his behavior are startling. Even she kinda senses it, and any debate usually winds up being switched over to, "But Hillary would be WORSE!!!"

    .
    Monkhouse: I want to go like my Dad did – peacefully, in his sleep, not screaming in terror like his passengers.

    System: Fake news?? Trump's a Fake President, for God's sake.

    Plat: I'd rather fellate a syphilitic goat than own a Cervelo.

    Homer: I believe that children are our future. Unless we stop them now.

    Seam: Saw Bjork poop onstage back in the day. It blew my teenage mind


  19. #19
    Master debator.
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    It will a tough Easter family get together if politics comes up, because most of my family are Trump supporters which is embarrassing and disappointing. And the reasons are typical like "he defends my faith, he doesn't try and shove the LGBT agenda down my throat like the libs" and "he's only saying what needs to be said and most people are afraid to say".

    I did read the entire article, it was looong thankfully it's a slack day here at work.
    "I felt bad because I couldn't wheelie; until I met a man with no bicycle"

  20. #20
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    I don't think it's that complicated or mysterious.

    One of the reasons I voted for Boston's prior mayor is that he said a lot about improving Boston for cycling and promoting bike commuting. I'm sure this guy had never even ridden a bike or gotten to work any way other that his own driver.
    I couldn't care less that he wasn't a cyclist and promoted bike commuting but never had and never would himself.

    Not a great analogy, I know, but I think it's the same point of voting on what someone caters to (or says they will) not what they do in their own life and that doesn't seem very weird or mysterious to me.

  21. #21
    Opus was just napping
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    I read the article but I disagree with the premise that the evangelicals ever had a way that was better than today. Did pockets of them work towards forms of liberalism and human rights, sure (within reason, just because blacks were free didn't mean they were equal). He glosses over much of the history, prefers the northern "evangelicals" of yore (because of course he has to) and suggests that the negative actions have spawned relatively recently. As an evangelical himself I wouldn't expect him to come to other conclusions he is necessarily clouded otherwise his foundation falters--this from a person who worked in republican administrations that actively through dog whistle catered and cultivated the white evangelical at the expense of everything else. He can blame Trump for taking the next step and using a bullhorn over a dog whistle, but the history of the devout in America is not a particularly good one to delve into if you want to retain your faith.
    In the time of battle you don't rise to the occasion you resort to the level of your conditioning...

  22. #22
    xxl
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    “I’m old enough to remember back in the last Clinton administration where America really had a debate over whether character mattered to the presidency. We don’t need to have that debate again. We don’t need to have that debate again. Character matters to the presidency and Donald Trump will bring the highest level of integrity to the highest office in the land. You can count on it.”

    Mike Pence, 2016
    More Americans wanted Hillary Clinton to be President than wanted Donald Trump.

    Donald Trump has never had a wife he didn't cheat on.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by xxl View Post
    “I’m old enough to remember back in the last Clinton administration where America really had a debate over whether character mattered to the presidency. We don’t need to have that debate again. We don’t need to have that debate again. Character matters to the presidency and Donald Trump will bring the highest level of integrity to the highest office in the land. You can count on it.”

    Mike Pence, 2016
    Bruh, so am I. I was 10 when all that went down. Pence was a grown-ass man.

    (My response to Pence, not to xxl directly)
    I lost my phone number. Can I have yours?

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    Where did I use the term racist? Why do you ascribe such usage to me when I have not used it?
    Why did you say that Evangelicals want a return of "Whiteness" to America?


    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    Evangelicals support Trump because Trump promises to bring back "whiteness" to America.

  25. #25
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    I think there are two ways to look at how people view Trump. Those who actually view him as a human being and the content of his character, and those who ignore that and consider only his promises and his past success equating to future success for the country. Of course any reasonable person has to consider the fact that he is probably a POS as a human, but the promises he has made that resonate with his supporters trumps all that.

    Hopefully even his ardent supporters have sense enough to realize he is not acting in their best interests, but I really doubt it.
    "I felt bad because I couldn't wheelie; until I met a man with no bicycle"

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