Changing speeds
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Thread: Changing speeds

  1. #1
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    Changing speeds

    I apologize for the last thread I posted, in which I asked no question. It was late & I...well, you know.

    This is what it should have said:

    Last summer my CF frame broke in a crash. I'm in the process of buying a new bike, but I'd like to use my existing wheels, which are 10 spd. The bike will be all Ultegra with rim brakes. Do I need to have a new rear wheel built, or can I just put an 11spd cassette on the current Ultegra hub?
    Before you criticize someone walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them you'll be a mile away & you'll have their shoes.

  2. #2
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    What are your existing wheels?
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  3. #3
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    You have yet to ask the question properly.
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  4. #4
    ngl
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Versatile View Post
    The bike will be all Ultegra with rim brakes.
    If your new bike is all ultegra (including wheels) why would you want to replace new ultegra wheels with used ultegra wheels that were involved in a crash! This makes absolutely no sense.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by ngl View Post
    If your new bike is all ultegra (including wheels) why would you want to replace new ultegra wheels with used ultegra wheels that were involved in a crash! This makes absolutely no sense.
    'All Ultegra' rarely includes wheels.
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  6. #6
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    11 speed cassettes will usually not fit on a Shimano 10 speed hub. (unless you are able to machine the hub or the cassette, or buy a special cassette that already been machined) There is one exception. Shimano makes one cassette with a monster huge 34 or 36 (or larger) tooth cog, that is recessed enough to fit on a 10 speed hub. I'm sure that somebody here knows what cassette I'm talking about.....Otherwise, you'll have to buy a new 11 speed rear wheel. (of course, that might be obsolete next year if Shimano goes to 12 speed)
    If your opinion differs from mine, ..........Too bad.
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  7. #7
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  8. #8
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    The wheels are fine & don't even need to be trued. The frame was broken.
    Before you criticize someone walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them you'll be a mile away & you'll have their shoes.

  9. #9
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    I thought I had. Everyone else seems to have grasped the meaning. I'll try again for you.

    I have a 10 spd rear wheel with an Ultegra hub. Can I put an 11 spd cassette on it, or do I need to have a new wheel built using an 11 speed Ultegra hub?

    Better?
    Before you criticize someone walk a mile in their shoes. That way when you criticize them you'll be a mile away & you'll have their shoes.

  10. #10
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    The only standard 11 speed cassette that would fit on your old wheel would be that large 34 tooth cogset.
    a non-standard can be found here https://www.lascoconcept.com/en/11s-cassette/
    If your opinion differs from mine, ..........Too bad.
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  11. #11
    'brifter' is a lame word.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Versatile View Post
    I thought I had. Everyone else seems to have grasped the meaning. I'll try again for you.

    I have a 10 spd rear wheel with an Ultegra hub. Can I put an 11 spd cassette on it, or do I need to have a new wheel built using an 11 speed Ultegra hub?

    Better?
    Answered in post #9 8 hours ago and by me in post #10 4 hours ago. HG800 11-34 will work. Any other cassette will require new 11 speed hub.
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    So the 8000 11-speed cassette is compatible with 10-speed freehubs? I would be interested to know how this is possible. As usual, Shimano doesn't explain much on their website.
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

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  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    So the 8000 11-speed cassette is compatible with 10-speed freehubs? I would be interested to know how this is possible. As usual, Shimano doesn't explain much on their website.
    Read again...HG800
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Read again...HG800
    OK, I see the cassette is the HG800 which belongs to the Ultegra 8000 set, no?

    My question remains, how is this possible?
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein



  15. #15
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by MR_GRUMPY View Post
    11 speed cassettes will usually not fit on a Shimano 10 speed hub. (unless you are able to machine the hub or the cassette, or buy a special cassette that already been machined) There is one exception. Shimano makes one cassette with a monster huge 34 or 36 (or larger) tooth cog, that is recessed enough to fit on a 10 speed hub. I'm sure that somebody here knows what cassette I'm talking about.....Otherwise, you'll have to buy a new 11 speed rear wheel. (of course, that might be obsolete next year if Shimano goes to 12 speed)
    And that stunt drove me to dumping Shimano in favor of Campy. Shimano didn't have to do that. They could have designed their 11-speed cassette to fit on a 10-speed wheel. Campy did. Shimano hubs were compatible with 8, 9 and 10 speed cassettes. So were they just hoping to sell more wheels?

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    OK, I see the cassette is the HG800 which belongs to the Ultegra 8000 set, no?

    My question remains, how is this possible?
    Stuff like this used to be referred to as 'non inline' product but they've included the HG800 cassettes in the Ultegra line. When they released the first road disc brake levers they were R6585/R785...not Ultegra or D/A. I don't have a good answer for why, but I'm guess because they got **** about 11 speed road not fitting on 10 speed freehubs. With the big cog being a 34 they have enough room to make it work now.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Stuff like this used to be referred to as 'non inline' product but they've included the HG800 cassettes in the Ultegra line. When they released the first road disc brake levers they were R6585/R785...not Ultegra or D/A. I don't have a good answer for why, but I'm guess because they got **** about 11 speed road not fitting on 10 speed freehubs. With the big cog being a 34 they have enough room to make it work now.
    Huh? How does a 34 cog make the cassette narrower? If an 11-speed cassette needs to measure a width of x and a 10-speed freehub measure a width of Y, how does a larger cog change that? Is the spacing on the 8000 cogs narrower than on the previous generation?
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein



  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Huh? How does a 34 cog make the cassette narrower? If an 11-speed cassette needs to measure a width of x and a 10-speed freehub measure a width of Y, how does a larger cog change that? Is the spacing on the 8000 cogs narrower than on the previous generation?
    No. Because the 34 is so big they can offset the spider that it's mounted on so it will clear the spokes. Won't work w/ a smaller cog. Take a look at the back of one someday, you'll see.
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  19. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    No. Because the 34 is so big they can offset the spider that it's mounted on so it will clear the spokes. Won't work w/ a smaller cog. Take a look at the back of one someday, you'll see.
    Ahhhh, OK, got it!
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

    “Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital.” -- Aaron Levenstein



  20. #20
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    When Campy went to 9 speed, they changed the freehub design so that it wasn't compatible with 8 speed. Campy 9-10-11 speed freehubs are the same.....With Shimano, when they went to 9 speed, they stayed with the same freehub design, Shimano 8-9-10 speed freehubs are the same (except for early 10 speed)….Campy people were mad that they had to buy new wheels when 9 speed came out.
    If your opinion differs from mine, ..........Too bad.
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    Buying parts to hang on your bike is always easier than getting fit.

    If you feel wimpy and weak, get out and train more, ya wee lassie!

    If Jesus had a gun, he'd be alive today!

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