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  1. #1
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    Continental GP 5000s - A great tire finally gets an upgrade (including Tubeless)

    Continental is making big claims of big improvements.

    Looking forward to trying these out.

    https://cyclingtips.com/2018/11/cont...000-road-tire/

  2. #2
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    love the 4KIIs...the 5K is kinda pricey.

    might try them once they've been on the market for awhile and the discounters offer them.
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  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    love the 4KIIs...the 5K is kinda pricey.

    might try them once they've been on the market for awhile and the discounters offer them.
    MSRP on the 4KIIs is only $5 less than the article says the 5K MSRP is. I'm sure they will drop quite a bit. Will be interesting to see if the tubeless version lasts longer than other offerings on the market today.
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  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    MSRP on the 4KIIs is only $5 less than the article says the 5K MSRP is. I'm sure they will drop quite a bit. Will be interesting to see if the tubeless version lasts longer than other offerings on the market today.
    I'm sure there will be some great deals on NOS 4k's out there once the 5k's start showing up.

  5. #5
    changingleaf
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    I hope they last longer than some of the other tubeless tires too. Durability, in terms of puncture resistance is not the same as tread wear.

  6. #6
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    Love threads like this, passing on info others may have missed is one of the best parts of a forum... but I "must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Finx again".

    Still waiting for my last pair of Turbo Pros to run out so I can try Panaracers, but these will warrant a look as well.

  7. #7
    pmf
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    I used to think the 4k's were great tires until I tried Vittoria Corsa G+. Now they're just OK.

  8. #8
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    So they cost more than steel belted radials for my car and last far less long.

  9. #9
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    So they cost more than steel belted radials for my car and last far less long.
    It really is amazing what a bike tire costs in relation to an automotive tire.

  10. #10
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    I know. We brag about getting 3K miles on a bike tire that costs $60 but if we don't get 60K miles from a car tire that costs $120, we think its a POS. Bike tires are really VERY expensive on a per mile basis.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdhbrad View Post
    I know. We brag about getting 3K miles on a bike tire that costs $60 but if we don't get 60K miles from a car tire that costs $120, we think its a POS. Bike tires are really VERY expensive on a per mile basis.
    OTOH, bike tires slaughter car tires on the dollars to smiles per mile metric.

  12. #12
    changingleaf
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    I was excited when Vittoria came out with their tubeless road tires, but from what I've heard they turned out to be a real disappointment in terms of durability and wear.

  13. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by cdhbrad View Post
    I know. We brag about getting 3K miles on a bike tire that costs $60 but if we don't get 60K miles from a car tire that costs $120, we think its a POS. Bike tires are really VERY expensive on a per mile basis.
    Quote Originally Posted by pmf View Post
    It really is amazing what a bike tire costs in relation to an automotive tire.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    So they cost more than steel belted radials for my car and last far less long.
    Not if you compare to high-end car tires. They are very expensive and don't last as long. OTOH, there are plenty of cheaper bicycle tires that last longer than Conti mentioned here.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by bvber View Post
    Not if you compare to high-end car tires. They are very expensive and don't last as long. OTOH, there are plenty of cheaper bicycle tires that last longer than Conti mentioned here.

    But even a cheap car tire has 20x+ as much material to it. Which is the point. Shoot, my Panaracer GK SK 700x40mm bike tires have 2X as much rubber and cost half what these do purchase at my B&M LBS...and those are nice unpaved-road tires.


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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    But even a cheap car tire has 20x+ as much material to it.
    eh, it's really not the amount of raw materials...manufacturing technology, R&D, shipping, advertising drive costs...
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  16. #16
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    eh, it's really not the amount of raw materials...manufacturing technology, R&D, shipping, advertising drive costs...
    I think its mostly because its a small volume enterprise and they can get away with it. If the profit margin were as narrow as it is for car tires, no one would make them. Plus, the retail mark up has to be huge. I can get a Michelin 4000S on the web for half of what my LBS sells them for. And those web guys are making money too.

    Compared to car tires, bike tires have to be a tiny market. I doubt a bike tire has nearly the technology or R&D that a car tire has. They weigh a fraction of a car tire, so I doubt its shipping. Advertising? When's the last time you saw an ad on TV for a bicycle tire? I see Michelin car tire ads all the time.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Oxtox View Post
    eh, it's really not the amount of raw materials...manufacturing technology, R&D, shipping, advertising drive costs...

    Well...no one ever advertises bicycle tires, anywhere. And which costs more to ship--a 1/2lb bike tire...or a 20lb car tire?
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  18. #18
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    thank god for the UK online sellers, which always offer great prices tires throughout the year.
    For example, Vittoria Rubino Pro G+ can be had from Chain Reaction for $21. Free shipping to USA on every $49 minimum order. Other UK sellers like Probikekit, Wiggles, also offer deep discount.
    And I have never ever run into any cyclist who has bested me because he's riding more expensive tires. Not once.

  19. #19
    pmf
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    thank god for the UK online sellers, which always offer great prices tires throughout the year.
    For example, Vittoria Rubino Pro G+ can be had from Chain Reaction for $21. Free shipping to USA on every $49 minimum order. Other UK sellers like Probikekit, Wiggles, also offer deep discount.
    And I have never ever run into any cyclist who has bested me because he's riding more expensive tires. Not once.
    I just paid $32/tire for Vittoria Corsa G+ tires from Chain Reaction. Not only was the shipping free, but they showed up in three days. MSRP is something like $75. They might not last as long as 4000S, but man do they have a nice ride and corner really well.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmf View Post
    I just paid $32/tire for Vittoria Corsa G+ tires from Chain Reaction. Not only was the shipping free, but they showed up in three days. MSRP is something like $75. They might not last as long as 4000S, but man do they have a nice ride and corner really well.
    I use Vittoria Corsa G+ or Veloflex Corsa (an latex tube) for the front, Rubino Pro G+ (and either latex or thin butyl) for the rear. It's really the best of every world, money wise, longevity wise, handling wise.

    Also, another shop to pay attention to is Westernbikeworks "Deal of the day" (I subscribe to their daily deal mailing list). About twice per year, they will sell the Veloflex Corsa for $29 each in their Deal of the Day. Veloflex Corsa (cotton spun core) is on par with the Vit Corsa G+ in terms of feel and handling. Read somewhere that Veloflex was formed by former Vit employees who wanted to keep things manufactured in Italy.

    I'm baffled why people go googoo gaga over the Contis when cheaper tire combo are available, with better handling performance, on sale pretty much through out the year.

  21. #21
    pmf
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    Thanks, I signed up for the deal of the day.

    I'll definitely try the Veloflex if they go on sale. I hope not too soon -- I've got 10 Vittoria Corsas in the basement (that may sound bad, but there's 7 road bikes in my house). Veloflex was formed by Italian employees of Vittoria when Vittoria moved to Asia (I think it was Thailand).

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    Bravo for 32mm versions. I might try them someday, if I see them cheap enough. The previous contis I've had have been solid tires, nothing to get worked up over though.

  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marc View Post
    But even a cheap car tire has 20x+ as much material to it.
    Car tires are supporting 20+ times more weight. Plus, it's the economy of scale. Car tire market is much much bigger than bicycle tire market.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by pmf View Post
    Plus, the retail mark up has to be huge. I can get a Michelin 4000S on the web for half of what my LBS sells them for. And those web guys are making money too.
    Your LBS probably isn't making anywhere near the amount of money you think they are on tires. I can easily find a whole lot of tires sold online for what we pay for them through QBP or any other white market (is that the term?) distribution. Heck, we ran out of Shimano Ultegra rotors so we bought a bunch through a US online retailer for $1 more than we'd have paid QBP for them.

    We charge MSRP for all of that stuff but include installation. We almost always give the "you could find these cheaper online but we will not install them for you then" disclaimer when discussing these things. It's fairly easy to install cassettes and rotors and normal tires, but when we install tubeless tires we incur all the headache for any fit deficiencies and we also include the sealant. That is very often a "we don't charge enough for this!" experience in the shop.

    So bottom line, your shop isn't ripping you off on these. Or probably anything else. They just pay more because of f'd up distribution schemes in the industry.

    I also know that there is/was an OEM version of the GP4000s II. A guy who stayed in the same house as me at a stage race had brand new GP4000s II 23s that came with a bike he'd bought. They were barely even 23mm on decently wide rims, and felt different to the normal ones I'm used to seeing. That could be widespread, I don't know, it's just one data point, I don't wish to paint with a broad brush or scare monger on that. But they were obviously different.

    Although I've not generally been too hot on road tubeless, I'll give the wider GP5000s a try sans tubes. The vast majority of my recent miles have been on 28mm marked (32mm actual on the rims they're on) GP4000s with nice tubes, and their ride is very very nice. Psyched to see how these do.

    The Vittoria Corsa G+ tubeless are sublime riding but terrible for durability. A race day or special use only tire from what I've gathered.

    *QBP is "Quality Bike Parts" which is the 800 pound gorilla of US bike wholesale. They're actually a fine company to work with, and do a very good job at what they do.

  25. #25
    changingleaf
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    I couldn't agree more. Bike shops also have to comply with minimum advertised prices that are determined by the manufacturer. Some online retails do not always comply and can get away with it for various reasons, but they sometimes loose their right to sell certain products if they they get caught breaking manufacturers agreements.

    Although it may not seem this way, but the labor rate that many shops charge is really far below what the actual costs are, especially for qualified mechanics. It will take time for the cost of labor to get to where it needs to be. My friends that work at car dealerships tell me that the margin on cars is so small that they make most of their money on parts and labor, which is what bike shops with a storefront have found. I'm all for cyclist learning how to do their own repairs, but many don't want to for whatever reason. Bikes are getting more complicated all the time and repairs and maintenance can be expensive.

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