• 11-02-2017
    Pisgah2000
    Good tubeless (or tubeless ready) rims
    I currently have a set of Easton EA0 SLs, which are labeled as 'road tubeless'. These have a solid inner rim wall, so no tape required, which is nice. What is not nice is that I can't get any brand of tubeless tire, road or otherwise, to completely seat. Everything mounts and inflates mostly fine and holds air no problem, but I can pop the bead in with my thumb on all tires, regardless of tire pressure. I initially though that it was the tires, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I can't do this on any other Easton tubeless wheelset (MTB) that I own. Comparing the two, the channel/socket for the bead in the road EA90s is narrower than the MTB wheels, which may be normal, but it doesn't seem like it actually works as intended. I installed the same tire on the EA90 SL road wheel and an EA90 XC MTB wheel. The MTB wheel had no problems and the bead was extremely secure, but the SL had the same old problem. Seals enough to hold air, but not enough to secure the bead. Yes, I'm installing everything properly.

    So... my questions:

    Is the smaller/narrower/possibly shallower bead socket just a design feature of any road tubeless rim, or is it unique to the EA90 and other Gen 5 Road Tubeless rims (whatever the hell that means)?

    Are there road rim brake rims that have more substantial bead sockets/lips, or some other design that just works better? I'm fine with something that needs tape. I've had good luck with Mavic UST rims in the past on MTBs, but not sure I want to get into the "system" of their new road rims and tires (not that you have to, necessarily).

    I've noticed that the newer Easton tubeless road rims are no longer solid inner wall, but use tape over spoke holes. Do these still have the problem?
  • 11-02-2017
    upstateSC-rider
    I have a set of solid-bed EA90SL's that I had older Hutchinson Fusions mounted on and never had a problem with the beads. I can't imagine being able to pop the bead with my thumbs on 25mm tubeless tires aired up to 85 or 90 psi but then again I never tried, maybe I'd surprise myself.
  • 11-02-2017
    Pisgah2000
    1 Attachment(s)
    Huh. I'd be interested in the result of you pressing on the sidewall near the bead on the EA90s. Aside from this issue, it's a great wheelset. Tubeless is just really nice on a road bike that sees non-paved surfaces, and I'd like to find a reliable, safe way to do it.

    This is what mine do:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuRHCfI24yI\

    That's the rear wheel, and I've left the tire on there for the past couple hundred miles as an experiment. No issues while riding, but the bead still does that when pressed by hand.

    Edit - I was looking around at various rim profiles, and Stan's doesn't even have an inner lip. Does it just rely on pressure to keep the bead on the larger shelf? I had an older set of Arches, and I don't recall any issues, but how does the bead get securely locked into the rim? Or does it not?

    Attachment 320960
  • 11-02-2017
    upstateSC-rider
    Wow, I see what you mean, wouldn't think you could do that so easily, are those 28mm tires with low pressure or something similar?
    My EA90SL's have since been tubed and are now basically used as training wheels but I just tried that on tubeless 25mm Pro One's on Hed Belgium+ (86psi) and 25mm Conti GP4k's (tubed-90psi) on Boyd Carbons and can't get them to unseat that easily.
    Hopefully some of the wheel experts chime in...
  • 11-02-2017
    crit_boy
    Didn't we just have this thread?

    Yep,
    http://forums.roadbikereview.com/whe...es-362374.html
  • 11-02-2017
    Pisgah2000
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by upstateSC-rider View Post
    Wow, I see what you mean, wouldn't think you could do that so easily, are those 28mm tires with low pressure or something similar?
    My EA90SL's have since been tubed and are now basically used as training wheels but I just tried that on tubeless 25mm Pro One's on Hed Belgium+ (86psi) and 25mm Conti GP4k's (tubed-90psi) on Boyd Carbons and can't get them to unseat that easily.
    Hopefully some of the wheel experts chime in...

    Yeah, it's weird. It's a 28 w/80psi or so, but pressure doesn't matter in this case. The Belgium is the front runner for now, as it looks to be a nice rim that's reasonably priced. Good to hear that they don't do this.

    Quote:

    Originally Posted by crit_boy View Post
    Didn't we just have this thread?

    Nope. That was about tires. This is about rims. They're different things, so there's a different thread.
  • 11-03-2017
    changingleaf
    Most of the tubeless ready rims don't have a bead lock or bump or hump. If they don't they should have a wide enough bead seat to keep the tire seated on the shelf after the air is let out. The tire bead acts like an o-ring and seals the air in when sitting on this shelf. Air cannot escape unless you push the bead inward far enough for it to fall into the center channel which is what it looks like you're doing in the video. You must have very strong thumbs because I could not recreate this on my Boyd Altamont rims or Reynolds Assault rims at 80psi. Note the Altamont has a narrow bead seat and the tire falls off when the air is let out, but it holds fine down to 10 psi.

    The Stan's Alpha rim in the center of the image above has a narrow bead seat as well and the tires fall to the center when the air is let out.

    I think the bead seat on that Easton rim must be even narrower than the Alpha or Altamont, or you're really strong!
  • 11-03-2017
    Pisgah2000
    Quote:

    Originally Posted by changingleaf View Post
    Most of the tubeless ready rims don't have a bead lock or bump or hump. If they don't they should have a wide enough bead seat to keep the tire seated on the shelf after the air is let out. The tire bead acts like an o-ring and seals the air in when sitting on this shelf. Air cannot escape unless you push the bead inward far enough for it to fall into the center channel which is what it looks like you're doing in the video. You must have very strong thumbs because I could not recreate this on my Boyd Altamont rims or Reynolds Assault rims at 80psi. Note the Altamont has a narrow bead seat and the tire falls off when the air is let out, but it holds fine down to 10 psi.

    The Stan's Alpha rim in the center of the image above has a narrow bead seat as well and the tires fall to the center when the air is let out.

    I think the bead seat on that Easton rim must be even narrower than the Alpha or Altamont, or you're really strong!

    Ha... no, not abnormally strong thumbs. It doesn't take that much force.

    The EA90s seem to have a really narrow shelf compared to other rims. It drops off after the bump. So, the takeaway here is that the the bead lock bump isn't necessary, and that any road rim will allow the tire bead to move significantly inward with low enough pressure/outward force, but a nice, deep flat shelf should keep the bead sealed?
  • 11-03-2017
    changingleaf
    I agree with your takeaway.
  • 11-06-2017
    Pisgah2000
    Cool. Seems easy enough.

    So, what's the consensus on Bontrager's TLR system? Used Race/RXL wheelsets from a few years back are less than half the price of a new build, which is tempting.