Opinions On New Tires
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  1. #1
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    Opinions On New Tires

    Looking for opinions on tires..


    I’m on my last set of Vittoria Corsa G+1.0..and I’m not sure what I want .

    I use Latex tubes, with HED Ardennes Plus LT wheels.


    Looking at : Size 28mm


    Vittoria Corsa G+ 2.0
    GP5000
    Clincher and tubeless. (Or should stay away from tubeless)

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    Personally I like Vittoria Corsa G+ for the front, Vittoria Rubino G+ for the rear.

    stay away from tubeless if this is a mainly for roadie application (which I assume it is based on the tire size of 28mm).

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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    stay away from tubeless if this is a mainly for roadie application (which I assume it is based on the tire size of 28mm).
    Why? I would guess he wants a comfortable ride which is why the 28s, and road tubeless will do that nicely.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    Why? I would guess he wants a comfortable ride which is why the 28s, and road tubeless will do that nicely.
    I can't tell much of a difference in comfort between a 28mm tire with a tube vs one that's tubeless. So tubeless ain't worth the hassle to me. Furthermore, OP says he'll be using latex tubes, so that will close the gap between butyle tubes vs tubeless.

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    what pressures do you run tubed and not tubed in the 28s?
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  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    I can't tell much of a difference in comfort between a 28mm tire with a tube vs one that's tubeless.
    You won't because tubeless tires will be harder than tires meant for tubes. It's a wash and as you say, tubeless isn't worth the hassle = especially for road.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    what pressures do you run tubed and not tubed in the 28s?
    around 70-75 psi.

    I also ride mtb (hardtail). I run 2.2 tires. I used to run them with tubes back in the day (10 years ago), and now today I run tubeless. Running them at 30 psi. Even here I can't much of a difference in comfort or performance much. But since running tubeless in mtb is much easier to setup due to high volume, I'll run tubeless.

    for road applicatin, a nice 28mm road tire (Conti, Vittoria) plus latex tube will beat a tubeless setup in every way: performance, convenience, ease of setup, and probably return on investment too.

  8. #8
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    interesting, I just tried road tubeless 28mm tires and thought the ride was noticeably better than tubed, but I'm running lower pressure - 60f/65r tubeless vs 80/85 with tubes. (I weigh about 180lbs).
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    I can't tell much of a difference in comfort between a 28mm tire with a tube vs one that's tubeless. So tubeless ain't worth the hassle to me. Furthermore, OP says he'll be using latex tubes, so that will close the gap between butyle tubes vs tubeless.
    ^This...exactly^ Road tubeless is not worth the hassle unless you get tons of little punctures from thorns and the like. Or maybe you commute into a city w/ lots of wire and small bits of glass. And you're ready to deal w/ tight tires and the sealant mess. Ride quality will not change.

    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    around 70-75 psi.

    I also ride mtb (hardtail). I run 2.2 tires. I used to run them with tubes back in the day (10 years ago), and now today I run tubeless. Running them at 30 psi. Even here I can't much of a difference in comfort or performance much. But since running tubeless in mtb is much easier to setup due to high volume, I'll run tubeless.

    for road applicatin, a nice 28mm road tire (Conti, Vittoria) plus latex tube will beat a tubeless setup in every way: performance, convenience, ease of setup, and probably return on investment too.
    You should try lower pressure unless you're a really heavy guy. I'm 170ish and would inflate 2.2 tires to about 23-24 rear, 20-21 front. 30psi on a tire that size is gonna be pretty hard.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    interesting, I just tried road tubeless 28mm tires and thought the ride was noticeably better than tubed, but I'm running lower pressure - 60f/65r tubeless vs 80/85 with tubes. (I weigh about 180lbs).
    So do you think it's possible that dropping the pressure 20 psi was the cause of the "noticeably better" ride or are you seriously going to put it all down to tubeless?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    ^This...exactly^ Road tubeless is not worth the hassle unless you get tons of little punctures from thorns and the like. Or maybe you commute into a city w/ lots of wire and small bits of glass. And you're ready to deal w/ tight tires and the sealant mess. Ride quality will not change.
    ....
    Or, you can just put tubeless sealant into a tube. Superior flat protection, easier to mount the tires, and no mess......
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  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    ^This...exactly^ Road tubeless is not worth the hassle unless you get tons of little punctures from thorns and the like. Or maybe you commute into a city w/ lots of wire and small bits of glass. And you're ready to deal w/ tight tires and the sealant mess. Ride quality will not change.



    You should try lower pressure unless you're a really heavy guy. I'm 170ish and would inflate 2.2 tires to about 23-24 rear, 20-21 front. 30psi on a tire that size is gonna be pretty hard.
    You got that right, and I'm only 125 lbs. All my buddies think I'm running too high psi.
    But I've experimented with 20 psi front/rear, and while the ride is a tad softer, the feeling was just too soft and vague for me. Tires squirm too much for my liking in hard cambered corners or under hard braking. Powering thru sand, gravel, and hardpacked at 20 psi feels more sluggish when compared to 30 psi. I guess for me it boils down to "handling feel" (and I'm used to this 30 psi setting for the last 10 years!), and comfort second.

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    Quote Originally Posted by No Time Toulouse View Post
    Or, you can just put tubeless sealant into a tube. Superior flat protection, easier to mount the tires, and no mess......
    Til something gets in your tire and the sealant does it's thing. Mess.



    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    You got that right, and I'm only 125 lbs. All my buddies think I'm running too high psi.
    But I've experimented with 20 psi front/rear, and while the ride is a tad softer, the feeling was just too soft and vague for me. Tires squirm too much for my liking in hard cambered corners or under hard braking. Powering thru sand, gravel, and hardpacked at 20 psi feels more sluggish when compared to 30 psi. I guess for me it boils down to "handling feel" (and I'm used to this 30 psi setting for the last 10 years!), and comfort second.
    You do realize that there is quite a range of pressures between 20 and 30psi? For someone of your weight the lower pressure will definitely roll better than 30 in pretty much every condition I can think of. 'Feels' doesn't count. I can believe that 20 would feel unstable in corners for someone that pushes hard but I know a few World Cup XC racers that run less than that and I'm betting they get around faster than you do.
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  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    You should try lower pressure unless you're a really heavy guy. I'm 170ish and would inflate 2.2 tires to about 23-24 rear, 20-21 front. 30psi on a tire that size is gonna be pretty hard.
    CX, not to drift too far off topic, but what would you inflate 650b x 47 tires up to? Right now I generally use 30F/40R. Do you think that is about right for a 175ish guy who carries a beam rack (6lbs with gear inside) on a 23lb gravel bike?
    "With bicycles in particular, you need to separate between what's merely true and what's important."-- DCGriz, RBR.

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  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    Til something gets in your tire and the sealant does it's thing. Mess.





    You do realize that there is quite a range of pressures between 20 and 30psi? For someone of your weight the lower pressure will definitely roll better than 30 in pretty much every condition I can think of. 'Feels' doesn't count. I can believe that 20 would feel unstable in corners for someone that pushes hard but I know a few World Cup XC racers that run less than that and I'm betting they get around faster than you do.
    dude when I say "feel", it's something of an individual setup, it's why motorcycle racers have different suspension and brake and tire pressure settings, because their setup makes them feel confident. It's why one guy can be super fast on a Honda and crap on a Ducati, hell even 2 racers on the same factory bike can have totally different laptimes based on their setups.

    And just because something works for a World Cup XC rider, doesn't mean it's gonna work for me, otherwise everyone would be buying the same bike, use the same setup as the World cup guy, and become a World cup racer? In 10 plus years, I've experimented with all sort of psi range already, I know the trails here pretty well, to know what works for me. I'm plenty faster than many local guys who are using recommended psi, so what do you say to that? And the main reason why world cup racers are faster than me is because of their lungs and aerobic, not their bike handling skills. Yeah I used to dirtjump so I can't that crappy on an mtb. Man,.. don't be "that guy" to bring in a top-notched pro talent and compare him to a weekend-joe with a fulltime job like me... and walk away with the conclusion you did.

  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kerry Irons View Post
    So do you think it's possible that dropping the pressure 20 psi was the cause of the "noticeably better" ride or are you seriously going to put it all down to tubeless?
    Sure it absolutely is the lower pressure, AND I wouldn't run that low of pressure with tubes for fear of pinch flats. You can run lower pressures with tubeless tires and that's why they are smoother riding, when inflated to take advantage of not having tubes.

    I ride Conti 4000S II 25mm with Latex tubes on my non-tubeless road bike at 90 front 95 rear, no comparison to tubeless smoothness. Of course there shouldn't be any comparison because it's narrower and higher pressure too.
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  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    Sure it absolutely is the lower pressure, AND I wouldn't run that low of pressure with tubes for fear of pinch flats. You can run lower pressures with tubeless tires and that's why they are smoother riding, when inflated to take advantage of not having tubes.

    I ride Conti 4000S II 25mm with Latex tubes on my non-tubeless road bike at 90 front 95 rear, no comparison to tubeless smoothness. Of course there shouldn't be any comparison because it's narrower and higher pressure too.
    So you are running higher pressure not just because they are tubed, but also because they are narrower. Apples to oranges. So you have a different variable here which makes your argument that tubeless is smoother weak.

    WIDER tires are smoother because you can run lower pressure.
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  18. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    Sure it absolutely is the lower pressure, AND I wouldn't run that low of pressure with tubes for fear of pinch flats. You can run lower pressures with tubeless tires and that's why they are smoother riding, when inflated to take advantage of not having tubes.

    I ride Conti 4000S II 25mm with Latex tubes on my non-tubeless road bike at 90 front 95 rear, no comparison to tubeless smoothness. Of course there shouldn't be any comparison because it's narrower and higher pressure too.
    How often do you think you'd pinch flat if you ran the 'right' pressure in your clincher tires? I refuse to over inflate tires to avoid pinch flats. I would inflate tubeless and clincher to the same pressure. If I end up flatting once or twice a year that's fine. I'd rather have the pressure I want the 99.99999% of the time I'm not blindly running over a random crater or small animal w/ sharp edges I didn't notice. Honestly I think I may have had 1 pinch flat in 40ish years on the road. Tubes ftw.
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  19. #19
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    well CX,
    I'll admit it, so I went out for an mtb ride today, and decided to give lower psi another go, let out some air until my front/rear felt noticably softer, I didn't have a pressure guage, just going my my finger feeling, but I'm guessing it had to be very low 20s (because I could pinch the tires in about half a centimeter in on each side)

    Ok the ride does feel softer (as expected), especially while sitting down and hammering over the roughs. But I can't say if I went any faster uphill, but I don't care. For downhill, I can't say that lower pressure gave me more grips either... because my riding style is all about charging hard into a corner and then brake really hard really late and slide the tires if I have to, so I'm not really a finesse guy when it comes to corner on dirt, more like let the damn bike slide and float around corners. So overall, l can't say if lowering pressure is helping or hindering me, but it's softer on the bum while sitting, so I'll stick with 20s psi again, hope I don't pinch flat when if/when misjudge a few jumps

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    well CX,
    I'll admit it, so I went out for an mtb ride today, and decided to give lower psi another go, let out some air until my front/rear felt noticably softer, I didn't have a pressure guage, just going my my finger feeling, but I'm guessing it had to be very low 20s (because I could pinch the tires in about half a centimeter in on each side)

    Ok the ride does feel softer (as expected), especially while sitting down and hammering over the roughs. But I can't say if I went any faster uphill, but I don't care. For downhill, I can't say that lower pressure gave me more grips either... because my riding style is all about charging hard into a corner and then brake really hard really late and slide the tires if I have to, so I'm not really a finesse guy when it comes to corner on dirt, more like let the damn bike slide and float around corners. So overall, l can't say if lowering pressure is helping or hindering me, but it's softer on the bum while sitting, so I'll stick with 20s psi again, hope I don't pinch flat when if/when misjudge a few jumps
    Nice! I'd expect you'd not love really low pressure if your style is like you say. I worked w/ a guy that pushed the front end really hard in corners and just couldn't go below 25-27 or he'd feel the tire starting to roll over. I don't have your skills on the mtb
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  21. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    So you are running higher pressure not just because they are tubed, but also because they are narrower. Apples to oranges. So you have a different variable here which makes your argument that tubeless is smoother weak.

    WIDER tires are smoother because you can run lower pressure.
    you didn't read my first post closely - with 28mm tires I run 80/85 with tubes, 60/65 without which is what Kerry Irons was quoting and referencing. I threw in the comment about 25mm tires because of some comments previously about Latex and Conti tires which I'm familiar with on my non-tubeless rims. Bottom line, if you aren't lowering pressures with tubeless you aren't going to see the ride improvement of course and there's not much point in doing it unless you have lots of small punctures where you ride. If you want ride improvement and are willing to run the lower pressures which you can safely, then you will see much improved ride.


    Quote Originally Posted by cxwrench View Post
    How often do you think you'd pinch flat if you ran the 'right' pressure in your clincher tires? I refuse to over inflate tires to avoid pinch flats. I would inflate tubeless and clincher to the same pressure. If I end up flatting once or twice a year that's fine. I'd rather have the pressure I want the 99.99999% of the time I'm not blindly running over a random crater or small animal w/ sharp edges I didn't notice. Honestly I think I may have had 1 pinch flat in 40ish years on the road. Tubes ftw.
    What pressure do you run in your road tires and what size tires? At 170lbs (from a previous post on tire pressures as your weight) Enve reco for 25mm tires is about 66lbs as a starting point in your tires running tubeless, how many pinch flats with tubes do you think you would get running like that? Do you think your ride would feel smoother at that pressure? Generally speaking, a 15-20lb drop in pressure is typical for tubeless vs tube, and it's the tire pressure drop that you can safely do which results in the smoother ride.
    Last edited by Srode; 08-22-2019 at 02:06 AM.
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Srode View Post
    you didn't read my first post closely - with 28mm tires I run 80/85 with tubes, 60/65 without which is what Kerry Irons was quoting and referencing. I threw in the comment about 25mm tires because of some comments previously about Latex and Conti tires which I'm familiar with on my non-tubeless rims.
    Noted, sorry.
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  23. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lombard View Post
    Noted, sorry.
    No problem, I skim and miss the point sometimes too!
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  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by aclinjury View Post
    well CX,
    I'll admit it, so I went out for an mtb ride today, and decided to give lower psi another go, let out some air until my front/rear felt noticably softer, I didn't have a pressure guage, just going my my finger feeling, but I'm guessing it had to be very low 20s (because I could pinch the tires in about half a centimeter in on each side)

    Ok the ride does feel softer (as expected), especially while sitting down and hammering over the roughs. But I can't say if I went any faster uphill, but I don't care. For downhill, I can't say that lower pressure gave me more grips either... because my riding style is all about charging hard into a corner and then brake really hard really late and slide the tires if I have to, so I'm not really a finesse guy when it comes to corner on dirt, more like let the damn bike slide and float around corners. So overall, l can't say if lowering pressure is helping or hindering me, but it's softer on the bum while sitting, so I'll stick with 20s psi again, hope I don't pinch flat when if/when misjudge a few jumps
    Tubeless really lends itself well to mtb, I'd highly recommend converting if your wheels/tires are tubeless ready.
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    Quote Originally Posted by davesupra View Post
    Tubeless really lends itself well to mtb, I'd highly recommend converting if your wheels/tires are tubeless ready.
    yeah i'm already running tubeless on mtb, been so for awhile now. Nowaday, you can't even buy quality mtb tires that are non-tubeless anymore.

    however, even with tubeless, you still can pinch flat if pressure is set too low and you huck it and land on an edge (like a root or edge)

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